Comments on: Creating a perfect storm http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/ Comments on the state of education in Texas Mon, 04 Jan 2010 22:53:04 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.3 By: Harry Smith http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-2/#comment-167 Harry Smith Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:45:21 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-167 This deal that they are negotiateing is not a good deal. That is why she should have goone to a independent lawyer. She will have a hard time getting a teaching job after this if she does not force the district to get a new recommendation letter from the principal herself and a promise to give a nuetral reference. No recommendation letter and nuetral recomendation from teacher and district no deal. If the district gives her a bad reference then she can come back to them for breech of contract. She should then go after the parents involved the district will not protect them. This deal that they are negotiateing is not a good deal. That is why she should have goone to a independent lawyer. She will have a hard time getting a teaching job after this if she does not force the district to get a new recommendation letter from the principal herself and a promise to give a nuetral reference. No recommendation letter and nuetral recomendation from teacher and district no deal. If the district gives her a bad reference then she can come back to them for breech of contract. She should then go after the parents involved the district will not protect them.

]]> By: Angel http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-2/#comment-216 Angel Tue, 17 Oct 2006 19:52:14 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-216 As I would say on Sundays in reply to "Peace be with you," ...and also with you." I can say "and with your spirit" too. Your points are well taken. Just please remember and keep in mind that it was not all about the nude art. Bottom Line. http://www.friscoisd.org/news/mcgee_timeline.htm I have to ask you, metroplex citizen, what agreement was reached by all parties that Frisco "backed off" from? I don't recall anyone reaching an agreement. They put McGee on paid administrative leave back in September and quite frankly she should consider herself blessed to receive pay through the end of the school year. The new deadline is Thursday for McGee to either accept the paid leave as it stands or be prepared to truly be fired in the legal sense, which means no pay at all. As I would say on Sundays in reply to “Peace be with you,” …and also with you.” I can say “and with your spirit” too.

Your points are well taken. Just please remember and keep in mind that it was not all about the nude art. Bottom Line.

http://www.friscoisd.org/news/mcgee_timeline.htm

I have to ask you, metroplex citizen, what agreement was reached by all parties that Frisco “backed off” from? I don’t recall anyone reaching an agreement. They put McGee on paid administrative leave back in September and quite frankly she should consider herself blessed to receive pay through the end of the school year.

The new deadline is Thursday for McGee to either accept the paid leave as it stands or be prepared to truly be fired in the legal sense, which means no pay at all.

]]> By: Metroplex citizen http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-1/#comment-215 Metroplex citizen Tue, 17 Oct 2006 18:00:33 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-215 You have strong opinions, clearly stated. This is an issue that deserves the depth of discussion being done here, and kids' education is at stake as well as the stakes adults on both sides have invested. Mainly because the two points of view are so divergent do I say that the one good thing that may come out of lawsuits is that the truth will come out. I hope that arts education will not suffer in the process. The importance of the truth is at the forefront to me as I am reading a book titled the Oxbow incident which is not as much about vigilante justice as it is about how we each see and paint the truth, and how elusive but crucial it is. Earlier someone commented about an unorganized field trip without clear goals in relation to this issue. I can recall not knowing the objective (at that time) of why my elementary school took a bunch of what are called 'ghetto' kids into the Fair Park Music Hall to hear a live symphony performance. How can you tell such kids why you are doing that, except by actually renting the busses, packing lunches, and driving them there so thay can hopefully be overwhelmed by the sheer majesty of the music? We may have been poor, and undereducated at that time, but the impression and edification were lifelong enrichment that cannot be taken away. And I can't hold it against the organizers if there was chaos or lack of measurable objective that could be quantified. I LOVE music, and always have since that first excursion into 'your' world. I felt more American and European and human because of it and there's no easy way to communicate an objective like: "you WILL become more human as a result of this field trip". So, I hope you all take my comments with a grain of salt and are merciful, but brace yourself, because here are some more: I wonder Why the newspaper doesn't show pictures of the supposedly bad art the kids are purported to have been harmed by? The DMA does not display pornography, and I doubt they would steer kids to see such exhibits if there were any. McGee checked with them and they said it was allright to bring the students, so some blame should be placed there, not on the teacher only. Frisco ought to be mad at them, and not take it out on the teacher who trusted the museum. But then, many kids see the exhibits at the DMA, and teachers are not chastized for it. It is one of the most kid-friendly (and people-friendly) places in the world. The Frisco district initiated negotiations, and the offer seems reasonable. But then after an agreement was reached by all the parties (almost) Frisco backed off. Why? Three months of salary seems the least Frisco could do to end the debate. I do not see what's wrong with that offer, and it seems preferable to further humiliation for our state and what seems like will be a costly legal battle for Frisco. Lastly, as they say on Sundays, let me ask that "Peace be with you". (Would someone please reply "...and with your spirit"?) You have strong opinions, clearly stated. This is an issue that deserves the depth of discussion being done here, and kids’ education is at stake as well as the stakes adults on both sides have invested. Mainly because the two points of view are so divergent do I say that the one good thing that may come out of lawsuits is that the truth will come out. I hope that arts education will not suffer in the process.

The importance of the truth is at the forefront to me as I am reading a book titled the Oxbow incident which is not as much about vigilante justice as it is about how we each see and paint the truth, and how elusive but crucial it is.

Earlier someone commented about an unorganized field trip without clear goals in relation to this issue. I can recall not knowing the objective (at that time) of why my elementary school took a bunch of what are called ‘ghetto’ kids into the Fair Park Music Hall to hear a live symphony performance. How can you tell such kids why you are doing that, except by actually renting the busses, packing lunches, and driving them there so thay can hopefully be overwhelmed by the sheer majesty of the music? We may have been poor, and undereducated at that time, but the impression and edification were lifelong enrichment that cannot be taken away. And I can’t hold it against the organizers if there was chaos or lack of measurable objective that could be quantified. I LOVE music, and always have since that first excursion into ‘your’ world. I felt more American and European and human because of it and there’s no easy way to communicate an objective like: “you WILL become more human as a result of this field trip”.

So, I hope you all take my comments with a grain of salt and are merciful, but brace yourself, because here are some more:

I wonder Why the newspaper doesn’t show pictures of the supposedly bad art the kids are purported to have been harmed by? The DMA does not display pornography, and I doubt they would steer kids to see such exhibits if there were any.

McGee checked with them and they said it was allright to bring the students, so some blame should be placed there, not on the teacher only.

Frisco ought to be mad at them, and not take it out on the teacher who trusted the museum. But then, many kids see the exhibits at the DMA, and teachers are not chastized for it. It is one of the most kid-friendly (and people-friendly) places in the world.

The Frisco district initiated negotiations, and the offer seems reasonable. But then after an agreement was reached by all the parties (almost) Frisco backed off. Why? Three months of salary seems the least Frisco could do to end the debate.

I do not see what’s wrong with that offer, and it seems preferable to further humiliation for our state and what seems like will be a costly legal battle for Frisco.

Lastly, as they say on Sundays, let me ask that “Peace be with you”. (Would someone please reply “…and with your spirit”?)

]]> By: Paula http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-1/#comment-181 Paula Sun, 15 Oct 2006 17:13:31 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-181 Yes I do want to hear both sides; it is an interesting story, but the fact remains that no matter how bad I felt a teacher was, I never wished her or him fired unless there was solid proof. I knew one of the best teachers who was too strict and demanding on the students, got into trouble with parents because their little darling did not earn an A in his class. Other parents got on the bandwagon and started to complain. They threw in examples of rudeness, and he was rude to my daughter , too, but she learned so much, I excused it. They decided to take it to the school board to complain, but the principal stood up for him because his students' AP test scores were better than most, and the board backed dowm. Those parents were well-off finacially and loved the chance to throw their weight around town. That teacher suffered because of them. That is the sort of injustice I can't stand. I do not know, this case might be totally different. I hope I can either read about it or hear it and will wait to write anymore. Yes I do want to hear both sides; it is an interesting story, but the fact remains that no matter how bad I felt a teacher was, I never wished her or him fired unless there was solid proof. I knew one of the best teachers who was too strict and demanding on the students, got into trouble with parents because their little darling did not earn an A in his class. Other parents got on the bandwagon and started to complain. They threw in examples of rudeness, and he was rude to my daughter , too, but she learned so much, I excused it. They decided to take it to the school board to complain, but the principal stood up for him because his students’ AP test scores were better than most, and the board backed dowm. Those parents were well-off finacially and loved the chance to throw their weight around town. That teacher suffered because of them. That is the sort of injustice I can’t stand. I do not know, this case might be totally different. I hope I can either read about it or hear it and will wait to write anymore.

]]> By: Parent Chaperone http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-1/#comment-214 Parent Chaperone Sun, 15 Oct 2006 13:49:28 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-214 Paula, I don't have issue with a balanced disagreement. I take issue with your insulting tone. What is sad is that you have chosen to only consider one point. It is innuendo to believe that she was fired from that memo. That was not the case - her contract was renewed for this year. It is innuendo to believe that she was placed on administrative leave for the field trip in April. She was placed on leave for disrupting the learning environment in September. It is getting so much press because Sydney and her attorney have sought it knowing that most people will latch onto the story and let it mushroom without asking any questions. I can't help that one parent. I don't understand their complaint personally. I only can speak to my personal experience and that is what I have portrayed. It is not about me being right and the whole world being wrong. There are a lot of people saying that there is more here to support the principal. You and others like you just don't want to hear us. That is fine - just let's not get personal. The truth doesn't hurt me. You and others like you that want to insult do. Can you please cease and keep it about the discussion? Paula,
I don’t have issue with a balanced disagreement. I take issue with your insulting tone. What is sad is that you have chosen to only consider one point. It is innuendo to believe that she was fired from that memo. That was not the case – her contract was renewed for this year. It is innuendo to believe that she was placed on administrative leave for the field trip in April. She was placed on leave for disrupting the learning environment in September. It is getting so much press because Sydney and her attorney have sought it knowing that most people will latch onto the story and let it mushroom without asking any questions. I can’t help that one parent. I don’t understand their complaint personally. I only can speak to my personal experience and that is what I have portrayed. It is not about me being right and the whole world being wrong. There are a lot of people saying that there is more here to support the principal. You and others like you just don’t want to hear us. That is fine – just let’s not get personal. The truth doesn’t hurt me. You and others like you that want to insult do. Can you please cease and keep it about the discussion?

]]> By: Paula http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-1/#comment-213 Paula Sun, 15 Oct 2006 04:02:48 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-213 You are right. The whole world is wrong. The blames rest entirely on one trouble making teacher. No one else is to except responsibilty for this unfounded, unjustified public outrage. If anyone disagrees, then they are hateful in your eyes. Did you not get my point about people who judge? You do not want to get my point because the truth hurts. It is not an innuendo that a parent whined to the principal, and the principal acted on it. It is a fact and it sends the wrong message. That is really what bothers people, not so much the teacher. GET it. People all around the world identify with this kind of behavior. Why do you think it is getting so much press? Where there is smoke there is fire. You are right. The whole world is wrong. The blames rest entirely on one trouble making teacher. No one else is to except responsibilty for this unfounded, unjustified public outrage. If anyone disagrees, then they are hateful in your eyes. Did you not get my point about people who judge? You do not want to get my point because the truth hurts. It is not an innuendo that a parent whined to the principal, and the principal acted on it. It is a fact and it sends the wrong message. That is really what bothers people, not so much the teacher. GET it. People all around the world identify with this kind of behavior. Why do you think it is getting so much press? Where there is smoke there is fire.

]]> By: Fisher Parent http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-1/#comment-212 Fisher Parent Sun, 15 Oct 2006 03:47:28 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-212 To those of you who have children at Fisher, teach at Fisher, or live in this community, I'd really love to have the chance to talk with you all away from the bitterness that seems to arise on this forum. I am NOT saying that I have no desire to continue this public discussion--I still have the optimistic hope that we can bring some balance into this whole discussion. However, I feel like there are certain things that each time we try to discuss simply lead the conversation into angry outcries at how ignorant we are, or how superior we must feel ourselves to be, or any of the other mud that has been slung at our school and our community. If any of you are interested in having a discussion outside of this forum (perhaps even meeting locally sometime, if that seemed to make sense), please email me at frisco_parent@hotmail.com. To those of you who remain convinced that my failure to take an absolute stand on this issue (either for or against Ms. McGee) is a sign of my moral and mental inferiority--I remain perfecly happy to continue our discussions, in a civil fashion, here on this board, but I reserve the right to not respond personally if you send emails to the hotmail address. No offense is intended--that just isn't what I wanted to use that address for.... :) To those of you who have children at Fisher, teach at Fisher, or live in this community, I’d really love to have the chance to talk with you all away from the bitterness that seems to arise on this forum. I am NOT saying that I have no desire to continue this public discussion–I still have the optimistic hope that we can bring some balance into this whole discussion. However, I feel like there are certain things that each time we try to discuss simply lead the conversation into angry outcries at how ignorant we are, or how superior we must feel ourselves to be, or any of the other mud that has been slung at our school and our community.

If any of you are interested in having a discussion outside of this forum (perhaps even meeting locally sometime, if that seemed to make sense), please email me at frisco_parent@hotmail.com.

To those of you who remain convinced that my failure to take an absolute stand on this issue (either for or against Ms. McGee) is a sign of my moral and mental inferiority–I remain perfecly happy to continue our discussions, in a civil fashion, here on this board, but I reserve the right to not respond personally if you send emails to the hotmail address. No offense is intended–that just isn’t what I wanted to use that address for…. :)

]]> By: Parent Chaperone http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-1/#comment-211 Parent Chaperone Sun, 15 Oct 2006 03:02:59 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-211 I apologize for the type in line 2 - it should read "decides" I apologize for the type in line 2 – it should read “decides”

]]> By: Parent Chaperone http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-1/#comment-210 Parent Chaperone Sun, 15 Oct 2006 03:01:19 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-210 Paula, Why are you so angry towards our community? If you don't live here, you can't possibly know what we are about. I think it is truly scary when some one with no vested interest decices to begin a crusade based on innuendo. Your arguments are filled with venom and intended to offend. Why? I am at peace in that I know in the end, our reality will be proven and our district and school vindicated from this horrible media abuse. I certainly hope that you and others like you will have the courtesy to recognize your faults and at least apologize for painting an entire community with your slanted negativity. We don't deserve your abuse. Paula,
Why are you so angry towards our community? If you don’t live here, you can’t possibly know what we are about. I think it is truly scary when some one with no vested interest decices to begin a crusade based on innuendo. Your arguments are filled with venom and intended to offend. Why? I am at peace in that I know in the end, our reality will be proven and our district and school vindicated from this horrible media abuse. I certainly hope that you and others like you will have the courtesy to recognize your faults and at least apologize for painting an entire community with your slanted negativity. We don’t deserve your abuse.

]]> By: Paula http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/comment-page-1/#comment-193 Paula Sat, 14 Oct 2006 20:56:41 +0000 http://www.texasedspectator.com/2006/10/05/creating-a-perfect-storm/#comment-193 YEP, they sure went hand in hand with JFK, Jefferson, as I heard on the debate for governor, Sam Houston, Tomas Foley, Soloman, David, Clarence Darell, Pollack, Picasso, Poe, Hoover, Bobby Fisher, Chaplin, Kenneth Lay, and I could ramble on, but you get my point. WHO IS TO JUDGE if character=good job performance? That is where it gets really scary. YEP, they sure went hand in hand with JFK, Jefferson, as I heard on the debate for governor, Sam Houston, Tomas Foley, Soloman, David, Clarence Darell, Pollack, Picasso, Poe, Hoover, Bobby Fisher, Chaplin, Kenneth Lay, and I could ramble on, but you get my point. WHO IS TO JUDGE if character=good job performance? That is where it gets really scary.

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